Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Welcome to Aspergersgirl.com Forums!
Pages: [1]
  Print  
Author Topic: Defining "normal" in context of choosing how to be  (Read 391 times)
Kresjah
Hylian
**

Karma: +1/-0
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 58

Eccentric Northern Bugger


« on: September 11, 2010, 09:43:20 AM »

In a talk earlier today there was talk about what the definition of the word "normal" is, in the context of choosing to be an eccentric outsider versus a relatively quite normal person. I did have a definition that I found to work quite well (which I may post later), but I'd like to hear how you would define it. Do you have any suggestions on how to define the word "normal" in general terms within said context?
Logged
Shiroi Tora
Sheikah
***

Karma: +5/-0
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 222



WWW
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2010, 10:38:01 AM »

If the group members (as human beings or part of a smaller sub group) are on a path of success....then the ones who contribute (negative impact outweighed by positive)  the average minimum speed and quality necessary to sustain that speed to success. 

I would much rather be the positive anomaly.  They help make up for the negative anomalies.  If there is someone in the group with a better direction...I gladly follow.  If not...then I gladly lead. 

Since normal for some can mean a purely statistical number...I put in positive.  In the long run...nothing is sustainable if it runs a negative.  It is the wrong path.  A normal would have to be in the positive...regardless of the group....the others would have to be out of norm (non-statistically) since the norm is for the long term...a short term IS an anomaly.
Logged

Alex (my son) - 2E Child (Asperger's / Profoundly Gifted)
http://2echild.blogspot.com
Kresjah
Hylian
**

Karma: +1/-0
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 58

Eccentric Northern Bugger


« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2010, 11:06:47 AM »

I find it hard to understand how whether a group of people being successful and living lives that are sustainable for the future, nor whether or not a person is contributing to this success defines what being "normal" is.

Despite how diffuse these terms can be, I think most people will agree regardless of any presumed or known conditions that Einstein (and probably many other shaping geniuses) was eccentric and likely often an outsider. That doesn't mean he didn't contribute to the "success" that has led us to where we are right now, quite the contrary. Does that make Einstein "normal"?

At the same time, there are quite a few people I believe would be considered "completely normal people" who hardly contribute to the forward movement of the general populace. Assuming that any man on the street would look at a given person and say "he looks normal", and everyone who knows him or has ever talked to him says "he is normal", and that anyone who would know everything about this person would still consider him normal... if his exploits of normal living does not contribute to the forward progress of the general populace, does that make him anything else than "normal" still?

The way I interpret what you say would be that Einstein is "normal", and the person everyone call normal would not be "normal". I'm just honestly confused at you're definition, and figure that if I come to those conclusions I have most likely misunderstood what you're saying.
Logged
Shiroi Tora
Sheikah
***

Karma: +5/-0
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 222



WWW
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2010, 11:22:31 AM »

No...he was the positive anomaly.  The norm now days is one of more selfishness.  In times of affluence, the young tend to be spoiled.  While they are the statistical norms in that society...they are not the desired norms...to have a selfish society is to have groups of people operating independently and not working together for maximum effect.  The norm in society for energy is fossil fuels.  It is non-sustainable....a correct norm..if we are to survive and flourish...is to be self sustainable.  If...over the long term...the norm is non-sustainable...it is the norm that is wrong.

You are talking of fitting in with others...the true living of life is not to be defined by others...but to live it fully...in a positive manner...you define yourself by your actions in the face of duty (that which proves to be positive for you and society)...and by your in-actions in the face of temptation.  The whole focus is incorrect if one focuses on mediocrity...be the positive anomaly. 

Again...the norm is incorrect if one feels one must be "normal" to flourish.  So long as the person is not a negative force in society...then society really should have no say.  You have fringe groups who dress in flamboyant manners yet they fully function.  It is what one does that matters (and the positive results). 

Again...the question begs a false premise...that to be normal is to be desired.  No...strive to be the positive anomaly.  Be the highly intelligent Aspie.  Lead others to a correct...more efficient, and so, effective path.
Logged

Alex (my son) - 2E Child (Asperger's / Profoundly Gifted)
http://2echild.blogspot.com
Kresjah
Hylian
**

Karma: +1/-0
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 58

Eccentric Northern Bugger


« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2010, 12:18:30 PM »

I think you are reading far too much into my question. You seem to be going into what is right and wrong, and what is or isn't good for us (i.e., "true living of life"), what is positive... and that's not really what I'm asking for.

All I asked for was what the definition of "normal" would be in the context of choosing (if choice was possible) to be "normal" vs. being an "eccentric outsider".
Logged
Shiroi Tora
Sheikah
***

Karma: +5/-0
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 222



WWW
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2010, 12:24:12 PM »

The Positive Anomaly.  Not the outsider...but the leader.  Sorry...there are more choices than the two given.
Logged

Alex (my son) - 2E Child (Asperger's / Profoundly Gifted)
http://2echild.blogspot.com
Kresjah
Hylian
**

Karma: +1/-0
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 58

Eccentric Northern Bugger


« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2010, 01:31:16 PM »

Again, I think you are severely misunderstanding what I'm asking about here. If I come across as rude or anything now, I apologize in advance. I do not intend to be, but some of what I'm about to say may seem rude, simply because I'm running out of ways to explain what I mean. So, again, sorry if this ends up seeming rude, it is not meant to be.

Your previous posts seemed to try to explain what is a good way of living versus a bad way of living. I didn't ask about neither of those. They seemed to try and explain what you'd view as good and bad norms. Again, that is not what I asked about. You seemed to try and explain what is positive and negative to desire. Yet again, this is not what I asked about. Actually, unless there is a tie-in  to my actual question about the definition somewhere that I've missed, these seem pretty much completely irrelevant to what I asked about.

I asked in hopes of getting a definition of the word "normal"; a universal (relative to the context of the question this was to be used with) definition of the word itself. A definition would be objective, and not take into account what is good nor bad. For example a definition of the dollar, quoting Wikipedia:
Quote
The dollar (often represented by the dollar sign: "$") is the name of the official currency of many countries, including the [list of countries]
It doesn't say anything about whether the dollar is a good currency, nor if the current economical model in general is positive or negative.

"Normal", in the context I presented above, is a slightly more diffuse word. Some subjectiveness will likely be required regardless of trying to be objective, but it shouldn't touch the subjects of what is personally considered good or bad.

I did create my own definition prior to posting about how people here would define the word, but chose to hold it back a bit as I wanted to see how people would define it hopefully removing any chance that my definition would influence others, or lead to "what you said" responses rather than actual definitions... however, I guess I should post after all as an aid to what I mean when I say that I'm asking for a definition.

My definition of the word "normal" in that context would be:
Quote
The collection of the tentative common factors that is perceived as contributing to being labelled normal for a mainstream mass. Relative to your geographic local, regional, national and/or geographical international society (say your city, county, state or country, or even relative to i.e. "the Western society"). In layman's terms, the major populace(s) that you will be confronted with and compared to.

Does this make any more sense of what I'm asking about when I say that I'd like to hear your definition of "normal"?

And being completely honest here (and not with the intention of being rude), I didn't actually ask what people here would choose... just asked for the definition of "normal". The reason I at all mentioned the context it was related to is that "normal" can be used for so many other thing (i.e. "normal amount of money spent per month", "normal temperature rates for a specific climate type", "normal operation values of this piece of machinery") and tried to put it into a context to get the right category of definitions I wanted (namely related to eccentric personalities vs. normal ones). It's not that I'm not interested in the opinions of people here, quite the contrary... it's just that you are reading something I never asked, or rather, reading too much into what I've written.

That said, I accept and respect that you have different opinions on what is good and bad compared to me, and that none of our opinions are less valuable or necessarily more or less correct than the other. I just wanted to have that cleared, so that you don't think that me saying I was mainly interested in definitions meaning that I find your opinions wrong or less valuable, as that is something I definitely do not.

If you really wanted to give your opinion on the subject that the definition was meant used in then I won't stop you from doing that. However, if you do so, I'd like to say that the question itself allows you to only choose between the two... you are right in that there are several other paths than those two I've mentioned, but the other paths simply doesn't factor into the specific question I asked. It is an "either/or" question, not a "where on a scale from x to y" question. To quote the question from the place I posted it so that it gets completely correct:
Quote
If you could choose, would you be an eccentric outsider, or a relatively quite normal person? Why?

I hope this makes more sense now, and that you don't take it the wrong way. I can't stress enough that this post is not meant to be rude or insulting in any way (but I somehow feel that it is easy to interpret as such)... I just can't find any other ways right now of explaining exactly what I mean.[/list]
« Last Edit: September 11, 2010, 01:33:30 PM by Kresjah » Logged
Shiroi Tora
Sheikah
***

Karma: +5/-0
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 222



WWW
« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2010, 07:18:30 PM »

Yes...the statistical norms....but it depends on what kind of averaging is used.  You may end up with a mythical person who doesn't exist because of the extremes measured.

(Mean / Median / Mode) - The three major means of averaging (or normalizing) in Statistics.  Where one merely gives a mathematical average of all added up and divided by the total (behaviors qualified and quantified) is in the realm of absurdity because of the anomalies effect on the total.  Especially when talking of people...at work...we are locked in with major criminals at times...the normal person at work would be skewed...extreme good to extreme bad....there is no in between.  Depending on the averaging used...the norms would be way off...not reflecting reality.

You also posed a question that doesn't reflect reality.  When posed with a Sofie's choice...(yours was not really that bad)...it doesn't reflect true reality...there are other choices...to ask which one would rather be ..A or B....when the whole alphabet of ways exists...unrealistically limits choices...and actually pretends to give a choice when one is actually being chosen for you...so one is not able to really choose. 

Of all the various types of personality choices available to man..which would you chose to be...and why?  That is a question that involves true choice.

You were talking Relativism...in that whatever a group decides is right...and to be like that is normal....no.  The norm for people at work is not normal...nor should it ever be.  That is why you must take into account what I was talking about whenever you factor in people.
Logged

Alex (my son) - 2E Child (Asperger's / Profoundly Gifted)
http://2echild.blogspot.com
Nie
Royal family member of Hyrule
****

Karma: +11/-1
Offline Offline

Posts: 498



« Reply #8 on: September 13, 2010, 08:09:15 AM »

in all its simplicity being normal is a like how close you are to the majority, what theyre like or what they do.

if everyone is going left and youre going right... i think youre not normal. and thats it.
Logged
Shiroi Tora
Sheikah
***

Karma: +5/-0
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 222



WWW
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2010, 06:21:21 PM »

I think you are right... Wink
Logged

Alex (my son) - 2E Child (Asperger's / Profoundly Gifted)
http://2echild.blogspot.com
Pages: [1]
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF | SMF © 2006-2007, Simple Machines smf forum mysql web hosting | So1o Theme By Cadosoas