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Author Topic: Why did monogamy become the designated standard?  (Read 2233 times)
Felgen
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« on: November 07, 2010, 09:10:36 PM »

Am I the only one who finds it strange to spend the rest of your life together with the same person? Among the monogamous species, very few (if any) are mammals and none are primates. In most ancient tribe societies, both men and women had several lovers and among our closest relatives --the chimpanzees--(to quote Penn Jillette) "everybody f*cks everybody".

To me, it seems that everyone is polyamorous deep down in their instincts, but centuries of authorities pushing their moral standards on to the people have caused it to become stigmatized. This is probably why most relationships fail, why spouses cheat on each other and why most marriages end in divorce.
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« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2010, 10:16:22 PM »

In a word Evolution. When we came down from the trees we became bipeds obviously. The ability to walk and run as a biped with our skeletal system requires a lot of neural development and takes a long time. Our young start and remain vulnerable for a very long time (unusually so for mammals). Monogamy is the best strategy to ensuring the survival of our young.

Mangomy is common in 90% of birds too, which have similar problems when it comes to their young, wheares a very small percentage of mammals are manogamous.
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« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2010, 10:23:25 PM »

Even monogamous birds won't stick to the same sex partner. Also, a baby chimpanzee is quite helpless on it's own.
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« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2010, 10:32:08 PM »

Even monogamous birds won't stick to the same sex partner. Also, a baby chimpanzee is quite helpless on it's own.

Most birds mate for life. Young chimps spend most of their time with one female or another in trees, relatively safe from predators. It is a basic tenant of anthropology that monogamy is usually for the benefit of offspring.
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« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2010, 10:38:53 PM »

I should add that when circumstances allow - 85% of societies have historically allowed certain amounts or limited types of Polyamory, but it is usually only allowed in those people who are at the top of that particular social tree as it were. As a social norm for all classes and casts it has been exceptionally rare and I suspect we have a psychological predispostion towards Monogamy.
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« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2010, 06:02:08 AM »

In a word Evolution. When we came down from the trees we became bipeds obviously. The ability to walk and run as a biped with our skeletal system requires a lot of neural development and takes a long time. Our young start and remain vulnerable for a very long time (unusually so for mammals). Monogamy is the best strategy to ensuring the survival of our young.

Mangomy is common in 90% of birds too, which have similar problems when it comes to their young, wheares a very small percentage of mammals are manogamous.



I believe you are thinking of living in social groups or rather, social monogamy, not monogamy as we tend to mean it - as far as humans go anyway. The current scientific consensus is that living in social groups evolved, partly, out of the need to care for offspring for such a long time. Monogamy - one mate for life - is decidedly unusual in the animal kingdom.

Evolutionary speaking it doesn't make sense to limit yourself to one mate; the genes of a monogamous animal would not last too long in the gene pool and you risk inbreeding if you don't sow your seeds in distant fields. Chimps for example are not monogamous, they mate with different partners; but they do live in socially monogamous groups and they go on raids to capture new females in order to keep the gene pool varied.

Birds on the other hand, are the most socially monogamous - 90% of birds are socially monogamous I believe; even so, most of them still mate with others sometimes.

Monogamy amongst humans has its origins in various religious and social frameworks. A quick Google search revealed this simple, but to-the-point article: http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/lust-in-paradise/200805/inconvenient-truth-sexual-monogamy-kills-male-libido

Edited to add: Oops! I didn't see your bird comment; my bad!

The only thing I would add is that, another reason for social monogamy among birds is that, birds have a far easier time finding genetically distinct mates due to the way they get around: flying.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2010, 06:25:46 AM by Dappadee » Logged
Marco
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« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2010, 12:53:00 PM »

The Catholic church didn't go down very well here because they insisted on monogamy. The people here don't understand the word. Some people obviously get married and spend their lives together.
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Felgen
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« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2010, 08:15:20 PM »

The Bible actually allows for polygamy. King David did for instance have seven wives.
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« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2010, 10:01:32 PM »

The Bible actually allows for polygamy. King David did for instance have seven wives.

Only in the OT; the NT kind of avoids the subject and bends the rules to avoid making anyone look bad in the OT.
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Shiroi Tora
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« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2011, 07:04:29 PM »

The invalidity of the question lies in the word "designated" as if to imply it were engineered and did not come about naturally because it is a better way.

It all has to do with trust...and the willingness to make long term investments in it.

With commitment...all involved are willing to put forth effort...knowing it shall not be wasted.

It applies to the employee / employer relationship.  It applies to the patent process and companies innovating expensive products (which they wouldn't do were they not ensured a return on their investment).

Animals don't progress nearly so quickly as humans.  Societies fall by the wayside without individuals being able to reap the rewards for their efforts...(and so the great folly of Marxism).

As societies make progress up the ladder of hierarchy of needs as espoused by Maslow...there are greater expectations...and rewards.  Love is not possible without trust.  Deferred Gratification has no real meaning without a solid goal to work toward...knowing that the time invested shall reap rewards.

The "Hippies" and the hedonism and communism they were really all about...fell as flat as many of the rockers did from too much of their drugs.

Our children can expect happier lives when we, the parents, have a stable home to raise them in.  Why get married if it were not to protect the family unit?  

The real question becomes...with all the real benefits and happiness to be had from monogamy...with true love and the trust necessary for it to exist... with it being far superior to hedonism...with long term happiness overriding the short term...why have anything else?
« Last Edit: May 11, 2011, 02:17:38 PM by Shiroi Tora » Logged

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« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2011, 02:44:20 AM »

Hi,

Perhaps I am completely off here, but here's another theory.

The institution of marriage was essentially established not for love/happiness/a-warm-fuzzy-feeling but rather to ensure the maintenance (rather passage) of one's property (from one generation to another). Lacking a legitimate heir, chaos would ensue.

This would be far older than the Catholic church, most likely back to the general end of nomadic/hunter-gatherer society and the beginning of agriculturalism and the agrarian society (I would guesstimate 10,000 years ago).

Provided the male to female ration is close to equal, monogamy would always [eventually] prevail because - historically polygamy has been associated with the upper echelons society (and specifically with the farmer-class rather than the artisanal-class), this would be due to being able to afford (in one way or another) a larger family size - which would also mean each offspring gets a smaller part of the original property. (Which works positively when there is too much land to be worked on by one farmer.)

In other societies, which would be weaker economically, polyandry would prevail - the amount of children one woman (with multiple husbands) could have (as opposed to one man with multiple wives) is very limited. So the collective property of family unit would most likely be better divided for each successive generation (possibly getting larger rather than smaller as with polygyny)

[By economy, I mean, arable land; but it would obviously differ from one place to another.]

At this point, in Western Society at least, we no longer have [need for, individual] arable land, furthermore most family units don't have any substantial inheritance and/or property(if at all, houses being mortgaged, those loans where you get cash for your house when you turn XYZ, and it is still yours so long as you are alive) has kind of make the passing of property from one generation to another irrelevant and practically non-existent for the middle classes.
I don't see this as a modern trend, although it has greatly accelerated in the last 100-odd years (with overpopulation etc), but the idea of property ownership and "arable land" essentially started dying out (in western civilisation) with the fall of the Roman Empire and the rise of Feudalism; following which I believe the concept was ingrained in society too long to be simply tossed away, and of course religious institutions had their part to play in keeping the status quo.


Society's rules, though some might not make perfect sense in the present moment, usually made sense when they were formed (consciously or otherwise).

Quote
In most ancient tribe societies, both men and women had several lovers and among our closest relatives --the chimpanzees--(to quote Penn Jillette) "everybody f*cks everybody".
Not quiet, I believe there was a saying "for love there are boys and slaves, a wife is to bear children".

Marriage in those times had nothing to do with the concept of "love" - it was almost always a prearranged for economical reasons.
Arranged marriages have only fallen out of fashion for since about the Enlightenment.


Shiroi Tora: Commitment - when you are between a rock (social pressure) and a hard place ( the disgrace of divorce ) - how acceptable was divorce in even the 40s and 50s? What about bastard children? God forbid homosexuals!
People have no choice but to make the best of what they had, so they did. All these fairy tales we hear about lover eternal, till death do us part etc... It has a lot more to do with society than love, far more than one would like to think.


Just my 2c. I could be totally off on all points, or maybe I can't quite get my point across because I'm a terrible writer.
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Shiroi Tora
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« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2011, 03:04:18 AM »

With commitment...it is always thought of as lasting when one enters into the arrangement.  Whether or not it does...is not the point.  They enter it because there is no doubt in their minds...and it is not, automatically, a losing proposition...as would be if it weren't for monogamy...regardless for the original reason.  It is a matter of a return on their investment.  This argument is based upon people having a choice.  Unnatural results, would, of course, arise with unnatural circumstances.
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« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2011, 03:27:07 AM »

With commitment...it is always thought of as lasting when one enters into the arrangement.  Whether or not it does...is not the point.  They enter it because there is no doubt in their minds...and it is not, automatically, a losing proposition...as would be if it weren't for monogamy...regardless for the original reason.  It is a matter of a return on their investment.  This argument is based upon people having a choice.  Unnatural results, would, of course, arise with unnatural circumstances.

But that's the point, people - those getting married (hell, it is still happening around the world today) themselves didn't have choices. It was arranged by their parents/elders (be it monogamy or polygamy), whether they liked it or not, and there was essentially no way out of this "commitment".
You are brining in a modern concepts (freedom of association, choice & free will of child) into what is anything-but a modern institution (marriage/defacto-relationship). Its easy to forget that we live in a classless free society, where anyone can pretty much do whatever and associate with whomever they want, it wasn't always like this. If anything, this is the exception rather than the rule.
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Shiroi Tora
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« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2011, 08:28:27 AM »

The question is of modern times (become).
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« Reply #14 on: September 04, 2011, 03:00:44 PM »

I agree with the user who mensioned church (sorry dude ,pure attension span for names) but religion was such a key factor in our structure of society for such a long time. I believe it's a decline in modern times of tradition that has made us revist our animalist instints or disfuctions -  take homosexualty which i had spoken about in a past post. It's only been a few thosand years since the human has married it's own. But our brain has evolved over thosands of years, and probably still operates on a opertunist level, after all thats all the human cycle is, is to f*** and die lol. If we wish to have a part society, i still think we should follow the rules(this applys to rapists and murders- and the riots of recently) and not destory the stablitly for the ones who follow us. this is already a problem in the uk, as children who've had children has left a aray of broken homes, and unstable young people. i don't believe in the bible, but i think it's still a good moral framework for life.
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